I met Anna during a women tech workshop back in June, and since then we’ve become friends and allies in a journey toward sustainable change.
During our interview we discussed
Her purpose is to challenge social inequality and institutional barriers by empowering vulnerable social groups and communities through innovation and meaningful connections.
Anna, as she states herself, is incredibly lucky to have been exposed to various working environments and experiences: NGO sector, global corporations, social impact and tech start-ups. Thanks to this versatile experience she learnt a lot about the power of communities, social connections, mutual responsibility and open communication. While contributing to building and scaling numerous start-ups, optimizing and developing business divisions and corporations, Anna witnessed the ultimate value of cross-functional cooperation and human relations.
Anna is very passionate about supporting social impact start-ups and initiatives across the world, coaching and mentoring founders and women in Tech. She is consistently helping to leverage innovation in humanitarian assistance and international development spheres, as well as bridging an “artificial gap” (her words J) between corporate and social impact non-profits.
Anna loves her cats, her husband, reading, networking, engaging in challenging discussions with her Moving Worlds co-fellows from all over the world. She is very open to being approached on LinkedIn with any requests, suggestions, initiatives or just topics to chat about.
Katherine Ann Byam 0:00
Welcome to our episode. Welcome to the show, Anna.
Anna Derinova-Hartmann 1:32
Thank you so much. I'm really happy to be here. Honored since I'm a big fan of your podcast. And I'm incredibly happy to be here and be one of them.
Katherine Ann Byam 1:40
Thank you so much for saying that. I think the podcast has been a surprise for me as well, over the time that I've had it.
Anna Derinova-Hartmann 1:47
That's usually the best way you know. Once you plan, it all goes just boring, according to the plan. But the surprise usually comes the best.
Katherine Ann Byam 1:56
Absolutely. Absolutely. So I wanted to talk to you a bit first about your inspiration to do social impact work. I mean, when did you first think about becoming a leader in this space, and tell us about your journey to becoming an ally for social inequality.
Anna Derinova-Hartmann 2:13
Definitely. I actually consider my life so far on my professional experience a little bit of a computer game. When you go from one level to the other, collect achievements, and then unlock some next level, and you get to fight the boss demons. So that's exactly what my journey has been so far. I graduated with my third Master's from Central European University in Budapest and Hungary, which has always been the symbol of democratic values and freedom in Eastern Europe. And that already gave me a little bit of a feeling that okay, this is the field where I want to stay. But I will need very special tools and weapons and experience and knowledge to fight that battle.
To add to that, also my experience, studying at Northwestern, which has always been quite traditionally back in the US one of the democratic universities as well. So I found myself in Hungary when I finished with my education on the mastery level, at least. And that was exactly the time when the city was flooded with the refugee crisis when we had refugees stuck in a train station, not being able to go, not able to actually leave the place without proper food, without proper resources, not even proper hygiene and basic sanitary opportunities.
And then I just went there together remember back days with open society foundation volunteers, we just started sharing food, just talking to people trying to help them. And that was the first time when I realised that there is something the way the system is designed is not entirely okay. And I'm not a big fan of this phrase that the system is broken, I don't think it's broken. I just think that it's designed in a certain way that we might want to redesign. And then I got to work in order to design something right, you need the right tools.
So I started working with NGOs, especially in the field of partnership and cooperation with other stakeholders across and this is the first time when I saw how powerful the cooperation between corporates and the nonprofit sector can be. They just don't know it yet. And once I worked with NGOs for a while, of course, I got that first fever of “God we constantly chase the money.” And it's so hard to actually get enough funds to do all the good.
And I became curious. I'm always curious, I became curious to see how does the process run where the money lies, which is corporate. And, this is where I went next. I worked in a corporate for quite a while. I learned a lot about people and property management experience. And I acquired a lot of tools and knowledge there. Many people will say it's a heart-wrenching experience. The corporate kills your soul. No, actually it doesn't. It just depends. If you do have a purpose, and it's strong enough, it actually won't, it will enrich you because you get the right tools. And after the corporate, I moved over to working actually with startups.
And this is when I realised that one of my passions is working with social impact and social impact startups. And this is where I brought combined my people and business management experience, pro bono consulting, and support. This is where I learned how important it is to be empowering and supporting women, especially in tech. And this is also where I found an opportunity to channel how to, for instance, support refugees arriving in Germany, especially women, to find their niche and to also find an opportunity to work in Tech.
So that, you know, this what I meant by metaphor of a computer game. I feel that throughout my whole journey, which I'm sure hopefully only has begun, I've been collecting all those hidden coins, like Mario and I'm sure there are many more coins lie out there. But what I really learned is that, you know, the job experience might seem a little bit sporadic when you try lots of different fields, and then you feel, “Oh, but that doesn't mean I'm not consistent enough.” No, it doesn't mean that it just means that you try a lot.
You realise what you want, what you don't want, but every time you learn a lot, you get more and more tools into your bag. And then you carry that bag with you and you just become stronger in what you do. And your next journey. And next adventure.
Katherine Ann Byam 6:40
I love everything you said, I don't know which one to pick up first. But I'm gonna start with one. So you mentioned about systems being either broken or designed poorly. I love that. So what’s really coming out here is that we have systems that are designed for a certain outcome. And that's, that's a fact. That's what's happening in the world right now. And that outcome is not something that we realise that we want. So so it really takes a lot of reengineering, but it's a reengineering of our psyche. It's a reengineering of our way of thinking, our approach to the planet, even when we think about things like circular instead of linear. So what has been your experience in sort of pivoting that mindset in the places that you work?
Anna Derinova-Hartmann 7:28
And I would say that it's incredible and great that you mentioned mindset. And this is, I think, a very important starting point. This is what I learned. When Currently, I'm combining working in with corporate right now working in a startup, which is trying to turn into a corporate while working with social impact startups, refugee communities, working with the World Food Programme - that kind of startups as well. And what I see that all unites them is that exact mindset. But the mindset, which is very, very open towards changes towards improvement, you know, the worst that can happen if you want to.
If you want to change the world around you, you don't have to be here. You don't have to wear a cape, you don't have to have a Harvard Law degree. Go there and change the world. I mean unless you're Ruth Ginsburg. I mean she's one of the most badass women I've ever heard about. But what is really important here is your mindset and readiness to break the silos. The most dangerous part that I've seen, is when the silos are being created when one group, for instance, humanitarian people who work in the humanitarian field or in a startup field stop feeling exquisite, stop feeling special, and they just keep doing things because they have been done like that for the last 50 years.
Once that happens, you pretty much the social impact of such mindset is that maybe not dud at least, but definitely hibernating. So that's why I feel that there is such enormous potential and strength in this partnership between different bills. big corporate together with UN institutions, together with startups together with leaders, consultants. And it doesn't matter which one belongs to as long as there is this one strong purpose and the mindset that unites you. If you focus on that, there is so much you can learn from each other. There is no right or wrong definition of impact, right. It's just either there is one other is none. And at this point, I think as long as we remember that we can still hop on this train to you know, to turn a little bit of an imminent disaster that is coming - to turn it around.
Katherine Ann Byam 10:01
Absolutely. Again, more juice for the discussion. One of the other things that you just said as well, is about really bringing that mindset together in the social impact startups. And I found in my own work, and especially now that I've become an entrepreneur, become a startup myself, that actually, the easiest place to move is in the startup community. So even in my consulting work, I can influence more in terms of mindset, with companies that are just starting out to design, right, first time, I guess, as opposed to existing, well-established companies and even existing well-established NGOs. Because they all have a similar dated mindset, in some ways. So working with startups is so refreshing because they're open, just like you see. So it's so exciting to be a part of that movement.
Anna Derinova-Hartmann 10:58
Oh, absolutely, absolutely. But you know, funnily enough, what I also realised is that, if there is a way there is a possibility to bring this fresh, fresh air into a really existing and kind of established organisations, it is much harder but it is possible. And that's why for instance, I believe it is quite a tough battle too. For instance, by jumping on the ship of corporate social responsibility or community engagement in a big corporation, because right away, you need to try to understand what's the real motivation there? Is it marketing?
Or is it really something that the company wants to change? And but trust me, in my experience, even if it is marketing, I still strongly believe that there is a way to turn it around. Because in the end, you take these crazy resources that this organisation has and you start the conversation by conversations, step by step it will take forever, or for sure, but conversation by conversation, tiny step by tiny step by asking the right questions. And I'm a huge fan of asking questions. Well, exactly asking fantastic questions, by asking these questions, you will start very slowly, like waterworks with the stone, you'll start turning it around. But of course, that requires lots of hard work, perseverance, stopping this, if you will. But then the impact is enormous. Really?
Katherine Ann Byam 12:36
Yeah. No, massive, massive appreciation for what you've said, because I understand exactly the journey and I know what it feels like, as well as I feel the excitement of things changing, even if it's slow. Absolutely. So I wanted to ask one more question about these Sustainable Development Goals. So a lot of companies that are posting, their commitment to the 17 Sustainable Development Goals, even countries and you know, the UK has this rewiring project, bridge, etc. Where they focus on six of these goals. Which one of these do you think is most important to move first? And why?
Anna Derinova-Hartmann 13:18
Tough question. Oh, my God. I mean, it's like in a candy store. Which one do I pick? Right? Well, I'm a big fan. Incredibly passionate, I would say I have my top three. My top one is definitely battling zero hunger. Is that something that I mean, that's the basics, that something without I mean, let's put it that way. I cannot expect a person or a human being to be fighting for democracy and rights if he or she has nothing to eat or cannot feed his or her kids. And it's just how it works.
And this way, I'm an absolute fan. And I'm in love with the workflow programs and everything they do and how they combine innovation, partnership management actually and humanitarian action. And my top two is responsible consumption because this is something that we can actually directly fix. Honestly, if we want to. I mean, if you, for instance, compare it to water or environmental, I think we're so far already by screwing the environment around us that it's very hard to turn it around. It's still possible, but it's incredibly hard with responsible consumption is something that we are directly responsible and accountable for.
And it's just if we don't want to change it, well, that's not so I think there's something we can do. And the top three for me is the third one is a partnership because I strongly believe that the partnership is the way to go forward. The partnership is actually the only way that the only way to do to achieve success is the quarter success and my purpose. Personal purpose has always been breaking those silos, as I mentioned, not creating them. I think the only way to get better at this is to establish a partnership.
And I would imagine exactly in this particular order - battle hunger, while we look actually how we consume to make sure that we're, for instance, reducing the waste, the food waste, and we see how we can partner with each other because we won't be able to win this battle alone.
Katherine Ann Byam 15:18
Absolutely, I couldn't agree more. Finally, in closing, if you have any tips for social entrepreneurs out there who are trying to make a difference who are building eco-friendly businesses, do you have any tips for them on how to grow their businesses, how to have the right conversations, and how to generate interest?
Anna Derinova-Hartmann 15:38
Oh, absolutely. It's always easier to give a tip rather than to do it myself. I'm joking. Honestly, I would say, first of all, identify your purpose. Be very clear about your “why.” I've seen so many startups that were jumping into solutions because it's fancy to build a tech app. And they did not actually start with understanding the reality and ecosystem around them. Do not jump to solutions. And because a technical app is not actually the answer in the end, but most of the time, it actually isn't. Be curious.
I think every entrepreneur should be willing to understand how everything works around them and why it works this way. Very often, when you ask the questions when you are naturally curious, you'll get people around you. And you understand the reason why the system works much faster that way. And I would also recommend developing your product, whatever that product is in small iterations, and keep building on those. Because this way, you're more flexible, you can move 180 degrees, if that's needed.
And honestly, what COVID-19 taught us is that it's very hard to plan ahead about a week even. Do network and be brave, no one will do better marketing for you than you do. So just open up their talk, be it digitally or physically present. Hopefully, their physical presence will return again very soon. But be brave and network with people. And yeah, be open to partnerships and collaboration, because you're not alone. Fortunately, you know, COVID brought up actually so many social entrepreneurs and impact leaders and sustainable businesses that I think we're actually having much more hidden than we thought is there. And as I mentioned before, through this partnership, and collaboration, I think we can fix much more than we even dare to think.
Katherine Ann Byam 17:35
Wonderful. Anna, it's been a pleasure to host you on the show. I've loved this session. I think I'm going to be playing this back a few times. Thank you so much for your consideration. Thanks for listening.